Yeshiva Sanity: Moriah Town Hall Session

Thursday, April 25, 2013

Moriah Town Hall Session

Moriah had a "Town Hall Session" on Monday to discuss the recent changes they've made to keep tuition flat for this coming year. There's another one tonight at 8:00.

Here's what one reader wrote about the session Monday night:

"..it was great! They are working incredibly hard to achieve tuition sustainability. They are eliminating the multi child discount and raising the income level for which one can receive an abatement. This way it will be more of a needs based discount instead of an across the board discount. They were giving an AVERAGE of 78% discount to faculty members. The highest other school is Ramaz at 60% cap. Noam and Yavneh are 50% and 40% respectively. They are moving to a 60% cap. They recognize the shrinking enrollment but it's not necessarily a problem if they budget correctly for it. They are also moving to improve the morale."

"Also they reduced the number of administrators which is drastically reducing their salary expense."

Yasher Koach to Moriah for making the hard but, unfortunately, necessary decisions to stop the annual rises in tuition that their parents had become accustomed to.

Comments (38)

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High School Dad · 622 weeks ago

Bid deal. They are still over $15k and He'Atid is providing even better quality at $9k!

2 replies · active 622 weeks ago

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thatguy · 622 weeks ago

What metric are you using to substantiate a claim of "better quality"?

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get real · 622 weeks ago

Nonsense! It doesn't cost $9,000. The real cost is $15,000 just like everyone else.

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End Welfare · 622 weeks ago

HSD - I agree. In fact, I was recently talking to person who pointed out how it would be cheaper for a teacher to send to Heatid than it would be to send to [Legacy school] even with the discount the legacy school grants to teachers. How sad is that!!!

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kjp · 622 weeks ago

I am a big fan of heatid but the education doesn't cover all grades yet. Older students have to go somewhere else. Moriah is cutting admin and lowering tuition. They are doing it because they were forced to due to lack of enrollment and debt but it seems they are taking it seriously and doing a good job. Moriah is a largely englewood school. The parents mostly dont want to send outside of englewood -it is socially a problem for them and frankly many teaneck parents have a different hashkafa and dont necessarily want those kids in their schools. It is good for englewood to have a financially stable school

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etm · 622 weeks ago

Kjp - agreed with your post till I got to "TEaneck parents...don't necessarily want those kids in their schools" . what an unforturnate way to talk about fellow Jewish children. There is no difference in Hashkafa between Englewoo and Teaneck Jews.

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Just Saying · 622 weeks ago

Has Heatid published the results of testing on its students that indicate that it is providing a better education than any other school? Last I had heard they weren't able to even get accurate report cards out. Does anyone have any facts to prove better quality or is this just more hype?

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Isaac Shalev · 622 weeks ago

Let me get this straight. Moria is keeping tuition flat by: RAISING tuition for 1) families with more than one child in the school 2) Families that were receiving tuition assistance/abatement and 3) teachers. And they're also "working to improve morale" - I'll bet. The beatings will continue util morale improves, no doubt.

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Enough Days off · 622 weeks ago

etm - what planet are you on ? There is a huge difference in hashkafa between Englewood and Teaneck Jews. There are kids at moriah who do not come from Shomer Shabbat homes, eat out "vegetarian", whose parents dress very immodestly, the list goes on. Are there families like that in the other schools - I guess some- but it's much more prevalant in Englewood. With so many schools to choose from, why would I send my Teaneck kids to Moriah???

1 reply · active 622 weeks ago

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End Welfare · 622 weeks ago

"There are kids at moriah who do not come from Shomer Shabbat homes, eat out "vegetarian", whose parents dress very immodestly, the list goes on."

Well than surely these Moriah individuals you are slandering are worse people than the kid at YNJ who wears a jacket during davening and whose Mom covers her elbows......

Somebody please tell me what I did wrong to have been born into this crazy religion!!!!

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Yeshiva_Dad 69p · 622 weeks ago

Anyone's who's been to a Moriah Bat Mitzvah can attest to the fact that they are a bit to the left of the other BC MO schools. Just as anyone who's been the YNJ's beit medrash can attest that they are a little to the right. This is not a criticism or anything to be ashames or embarrassed about. It's a GOOD thing that there is a big selection of yeshiva day schools in the area. The big selection of schools, shuls and kosher restaurants make this area a big draw for MO families.

The fact that there is now a selection of educational models in the area is good too. He'atid may not be for everyone but we're lucky to at least have the option for those who want it. For those who don't there are still another 5 orthodox yeshiva day schools in the area, some a little to the left, some a bit to the right.

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Daniel Rosen · 622 weeks ago

"Anyone's who's been to a Moriah Bat Mitzvah can attest to the fact that they are a bit to the left of the other BC MO schools. Just as anyone who's been the YNJ's beit medrash can attest that they are a little to the right."

I have been to YNJ bat mitzvah's which smack of being quite to the left of other YNJ bat mitzvahs, and to the left of bat mitzvahs I have attended of students at other local yeshivot. I even threw one. And I have been in the beit medrash of a number of different schools and found no substantial difference -- each school had kids who were engrossed and those who weren't. And often, the engrossed students weren't the ones from the expected families.

There is a wide range of observance and belief among Teaneck families. Broad, geographical generalizations which attempt to characterize a school's hashkafa by summarizing one person's assessment of a mass of people's disparate beliefs are doomed to fail.

Are their more kids whose parents own black hats in one school vs. another? Maybe. But there are plenty of people in black hats whose personal belief and practice make me uncomfortable. And mine, no doubt, make others wonder. Do we benefit from these silly over-statements about one town's families vs. another? Communities are made of individuals. There is no township Terms of Use that one must sign onto the dictate religious behavior. In each community there are shuls, and neighborhoods and cliques and circles, each with its own particular bent.

2 replies · active 622 weeks ago

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Yeshiva_Dad 69p · 622 weeks ago

Daniel,

Would you agree with the statement that generally men are taller than women or would the existence of exceptions negate the rule?
-YD

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Daniel Rosen · 622 weeks ago

the clear and quantifiable statistic of measurable height can be ascertained and trends and correlations charted (though not necessarily compared when considered across certain groupings). Religiosity, belief, observance etc are not subject to those strict limits, definitions and measurements. Establishing the rule is impossible, so deciding who gets to be the exception can't happen. There are plenty of parents in each school whose observance is at odds with plenty of others. Do we make rules based on a vocal minority, especially if we have no way of counting the sides?

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S.P. · 622 weeks ago

ok then what is the reason that very few Teaneck kids go to Moriah? Years ago they were shut out, but there certainly is room now - and the education is supposed to be fine /on par with other schools . .. .

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Daniel Rosen · 622 weeks ago

I can't answer for other parents but from simple observation, I have seen a tide turn. When Teaneck parents were shut out, the tide turned to other schools -- not primarily for hashkafik reasons (remember, the Teaneck parents were trying to get in to Moriah in the first place) but because of many other variables (older siblings, neighborhood trends, proximity and some pedagogical preferences). School populations ebb and flow (BPY used to be the Sephardi school...) and change as parents make their own complex decisions.

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Daniel Rosen · 622 weeks ago

and, oh yes, a sense of resentment -- they don't want us so we won't want them.

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S.P. · 622 weeks ago

i just dont agree with you - we can say that there is a range in the Teaneck schools in obsrevance, but Moriah as a whole, and Englewood, tends to be to the left of all of them - in terms of level of observance. I agree it might have started out from a sense of resentment or siblings - but it was years ago and there are many new teaneck families who didnt' have children in the school system then who just wont send to Moriah. Social is part of it - but hashkafa and what is referred to as the Englewood mentaility (fancier, wealthier, more materialistic) is also part of it. You and others can decide if that is a put down -or instead just a statement, as YD said, of people holding different ways. For me - it is not bad or good - I just believe that hashkafa currently plays a major role in parents not being willing to send there.

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Daniel Rosen · 622 weeks ago

is tying the phrase "fancier, wealthier, more materialistic" to a notion of religious belief fair? I know plenty of people in Teaneck who live on fancy unnamed streets who wear black hats.

I know in my community what drives people's decision to send away from Moriah is mostly inertia. All the kids go elsewhere so the wish for playdates with local kids who are friends from school makes Moriah a less attractive choice.

I have yet to hear, in my 15 or so years here, anyone use hashkafa or the religiosity of the parent body as a reason not to send to Moriah.

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S.P. · 622 weeks ago

no - it isn't a notion of religious belief - in my reply i wrote about social reasons also playing a role
So i have heard quite a few people speak about the hashkafa and the religiosity of the parent body as a reason not to send - that is why I posted what i did - i didn't make it up - i took it from what people have told me as to why they wont send to the school.

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Daniel Rosen · 622 weeks ago

OK, so if I have never heard it, and you have heard it, and assuming that neither of us is either lying nor basing this statement on a ridiculously small sample, is it safe to say that the reactions to Moriah are varied and therefore not so overwhelming as to be conclusive proof of either position?

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End Welfare · 622 weeks ago

There are people who wear black hats and molest kids. Why all the focus on stupid externals all the time?

1 reply · active 622 weeks ago

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Yeshiva_Dad 69p · 622 weeks ago

EW,

No shortage of scandals from people wearing srugim in BC
-YD

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S.P. · 622 weeks ago

ha - not sure - my only point is that i do believe that hashgafa plays a role in why many people wont send to the school

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Guest · 622 weeks ago

Teaneck parents arent choosing Moriah because "no one else goes." Hashkafically Yavneh and Moriah, and the parent bodies, are VERY similar. Both are "to the left" of YNJ and possibly Noam. But using external (and imo BS) criteria like pants wearing, type of simcha, eating out... you will find little difference between Yavneh & Moriah

1 reply · active 622 weeks ago

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S.P. · 622 weeks ago

you really think that Moriah is only 'possibly' to the left of Noam??? ok - i guess Teaneck is large enough that i talk to many different parents than Daniel Rosen and Guest do

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teaneck · 622 weeks ago

if moriah cost significantly less than yavneh i would send there but if it costs the same or more whats the point when all my kids friends go to yavneh.

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Truth · 622 weeks ago

Finally an unbiased piece by someone with real experience.
http://www.thejewishweek.com/editorial-opinion/op...

1 reply · active 622 weeks ago

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B G · 622 weeks ago

Real experience at what? I'll pass on "Rabbi" Shira's opinion.

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Just Saying · 622 weeks ago

The bold initiative quoted in this article which is supported by the people behind Heatid states that the savings potential is $1,000 per student. Heatid claims that they are realizing savings many times that amount because of their new educational approach. Once again raises the questions of what Heatid parents are giving up. Certainly blended learning is not the reason why the tuition is so low.

1 reply · active 622 weeks ago

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End Welfare · 622 weeks ago

"Once again raises the questions of what Heatid parents are giving up."

Fair question. Heatid parents are giving up numerous things including (1) building funds; (2) journal fees; (3) dinner fees; (4) security fees; (5) registration fees. I could keep going if you would like me to......

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Just Saying · 622 weeks ago

That's a rather trite answer to a fairly serious question. We are after all talking about the education of children which for many of us is important. I would think all Heatid parents would like to have a serious answer that goes beyond 'yay, we aren't paying fees'. In all the promotional material for Heatid the focus is on blended learning as the way to lower cost and not lose out on quality. The BOLD initiative indicates blended learning should save about $1,000 per child. Where does the rest of the savings come from?

1 reply · active 622 weeks ago

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kjp · 622 weeks ago

Potential overall operating reductions of 25 percent

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kjp · 622 weeks ago

Are you a heatid parent ? What makes you think they dont have the answers just cause you dont ?

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kjp · 622 weeks ago

Btw I am a heatid parent. I have the answers I need. How patronizing of you to think that you are the only one who can do proper research on a school just because you dont send your kids to heatid. This might come as a surprise to you since you appear to know very little about the school. But the parents I know visited the school. Took a tour. Went to the open houses. Spoke to the principal. They dont need some annonymous fool on a blog asking questions on their behalf. And no I wont share what I know with you. If you want more info call the school or talk to a board member.

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Just Saying · 622 weeks ago

kjp - name calling is very unbecoming. Perhaps there is someone else who can provide an answer.

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kjp · 622 weeks ago

Don't take offense. I was just saying.

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Just Saying · 622 weeks ago

No offense. I can understand that it must be difficult to respond to these basic questions given the absence of any supporting data or logic so it is just easier to lash out at the one asking the question.

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