Right now the only YDS in BC open on Chol Hamoed Succot is BPY. They are planning activities for the children that don't involve writing. Word on the street is that Yavneh will be open next year as well. They should ALL be open.
Principals will claim that halacha forbids writing on Chol Hamoed unless it is truly necessary or it is done "kili'achar yad" (in a backhanded fashion). Some schools in the past have told children to write with their left hands (or right hands if they are lefties) or to write with crayons, or something else that they don't normally use.
Here's the reality though. Instead of writing a few hundred words in school kids will be texting a few thousand words from home, which is arguably just as bad. And the parents will mostly be working, whether it is truly necessary or not (except those who can't work because their kids are off or they work for Jewish institutions). I'm pretty sure the poll to the right will confirm that.
I can't help thinking the halachic argument is an excuse for teachers & admins to take a week off while the rest of us work to pay their salaries. If we truly need to take this week off then it should be made up for on other days so that we can have the same number of school days as the public schools, who themselves have too few when compared to other countries.
Chag Sameach everyone!
Logging you in...
Jew · 652 weeks ago
Now that the kids are older, they can stay at home by themselves. This means tons of TV and idle time. If I'm lucky, they will heed my calls from work to read or go outside and play some ball for an hour.
This break is obviously meant for the administration and wealthier parents to be able to take their long vacations to Israel. Many teachers even leave days early and come back late. And the day after the Yom Tov is not even a school day at my daughter's HS. This is a big frustration. The start of the school year is already disrupted by yom tomv's. Adding this extra long vacation is just silly.
Jew · 652 weeks ago
AztecQueen2000 · 651 weeks ago
Ira · 651 weeks ago
Is it babysitting while parents work, in that case, there should never be any days off. We should have school 365 days a year, just allow parents to take their kids out of school, whenever they feel it is in their "best interest".
Is it just to make sure that our children are an environment that they have the sufficient background not to intermarry?
Is it to give them the tools to prepare themselves to become self sufficient?
Is it to teach them Torah?
The problem is, that for some people its one of these, others a combination, there is no clear cut answer for anyone.
But it is important to allot of people to have their children learn torah in a torah environment (whatever that is, can be defined by different people). And in this case, it is pretty clear in halacha, that one is not supposed to work on Chol Hamoed unless they really do not have a choice. Its not even about writing and how you write. (And texting and computer work according to many poskim isn't such a big deal on chol hamoed).
Its a shame that for many in our community Chol Hamoed is dismissed as irrelevent, while in actuality its more important as a Jewish holiday than Chanuka, Purim, Yom Ha'atzmaot, and Yom Yerushalayim.
People do need to go to work. In fact, I will be going to work as well. But we cant send our kids to an institution that is faithful to halacha, and then be upset that they are following it (to their interpretation).
Also, one needs to put into perspective the "same number of school days" argument that YS and others keep on bringing up. I'd prefer to compare the amount of "school hours" that our children are sitting through each year.Our school day is 2-3 hours longer each day than the PS system, and if you take into account davening (yes, davening in yeshiva is chinuch too, we are teaching them how to daven), then its 4-5 hours longer each day. Throw in mishmar and the longer days for our older children, and the public school, school hours in a year, pales in comparison with the amount of school hours in a year.
We need to stop complaining about each individual need, and look to see what is really important and what the goal is. We cannot have a school to individually fit each child's needs. Nor can we have a school to fit each parent's needs.
Community schools need to have community goals for schools. If we need afterschool babysitting services, or other venues for kids to go during vacation then the community can be creative in setting them up. There are communities that have trips for children on chol hamoed, and activities for them to do. We can't just throw our hands up in the air and place the blame on the schools for not providing us with child care during their vacation period.
Another thing to think about is, what kind of message are we sending our kids, if we do not give them vacation during the chagim. How important is it to us? It makes us wonder, that if we were able to take off from work, would we chose to take off during the chagim, or would we take off when we could go to Florida or another exotic location? Do we want our schools vacationing during the chagim, or during Christmas season?
These are important discussions to have. There are no clear cut answers or solutions, but they aren't as one sided as some make it out to be.
R U SURE IRA · 651 weeks ago
2. BPY AND Chabad of Tenafly is open for CH...are you saying they are breaking Orthodox Halacha?
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For anyone out there with some knowledge on the issue...
Didn't He'Atid mention CH Sukkot as "joke days off" at their parlor meetings? Are they open / closed?
guest · 651 weeks ago
guest4 · 651 weeks ago
Guest - i believe there is also a halachic issue working on erev yom kippur. If the school year was longer, the kids would just have more nights on tons of homework. The homework reinforces the school learning. You are just looking for something to complain about.
School is not babysitting. If your child went to TPS - they also have bs days off, like when all the teachers go to a conference, or early dismissals each month for professional development days.
R U SURE IRA · 651 weeks ago
guest · 651 weeks ago
guest · 651 weeks ago
How is He'Atid being closed for Chol Hamoed good for their parent body?
Sora · 651 weeks ago
anon · 651 weeks ago
tesyaa · 651 weeks ago
But Sora, do you really think teachers will walk en masse if they have to work chol hamoed or a few more days per year? Where will they go? How many are qualified to work in public schools, and how many public school jobs are out there?
Yeshiva_Dad 69p · 651 weeks ago
1. public schools have school on chol hamoed as well.
2. It wouldn't be such an imposition if all the schools had school so the younger teachers can have somewhere to send their kids
3. No walk-out at BPY after they announced they were having classes on chol hamoed
4. Most importantly we all have to sacrifice in order to bring down tuition costs. It's the only way we can sustain the system. Parents should learn to live with higher student teacher ratios, admins need to take on more work so there wouldn't be a need for so many of them and teachers need to put in a few more hours. We can't ask them to get paid less than the small amounts they are already being paid but working 180 days per year is not too much to ask. It is still far less than anyone who works full time.
guest4 · 651 weeks ago
Many of them are already working 2-3 more weeks than they used to 8-10 years ago when calendars has 163-4 days in it. They didn't see an equivalent jump in pay.
Maybe BPY didn't have a walk out, but I'd guess the most of the staff is not exactly jumping for joy.
Sora is right - the teachers need to be compensated and this can mean in increase in your tuition. More days of school also increases operating expenses.
Yeshiva_Dad 69p · 651 weeks ago
I'm sorry they have to work a few more days & they have the right to gripe about it. But they still have much more of a quality-of-life job then the rest of us. They are not struggling to try to stay productive while taking 7 days off in tishrei plus a bunch of erev's that collectively add about another 2.
-YD
guest4 · 651 weeks ago
Teacher's choose their professional in part b/c of the quality of life aspect. You could have also but you didn't.
Yeshiva_Dad 69p · 651 weeks ago
What does that mean? Is Teaneck adding houses?
Yeshiva_Dad 69p · 651 weeks ago
guest · 651 weeks ago
guest · 651 weeks ago
I think your blog is amazing and has definitely provided a forum in which people can more openly (and without fear of community backlash) discuss Jewish education costs and education issues. Thank you.
Although, I am just a bit confused .... re cost and parental expectations for days in and out of school. We all grew up staying home on chol hamoed. This is not a new or out of the blue concept. What has changed is that most families have become dual income and there is no longer anyone at home (generally a mother) to watch the children. This is something that parents were well aware of when they registered their children and as such, what is all the griping about? Yes, it sucks to feel that we (collectively) are in a no win, expensive, and not wholly fabulous Jewish educational system. But no one is holding a gun to your head to say - you will be in cherem if you send your children to the public school. If public education enables a dual income family to a one income family - enabling one of the parents to stay home and lower the stress level while allowing for less frenetic end of day time with children and homework and holidays and chol hamoed and exhuastion.... Why not just try it?
But on another note - I looked at the tuition listing on the blog and I was shocked to note that about 12 years ago I paid far more for my child's nursery and pre-K tuition at Chabad of the Upper West Side than many are paying for Middle School in NJ today. What is all the complaining about? This is what education costs! If you choose to have many children and send them to Jewish Day School, then you will have a large tuition bill.
Guest · 651 weeks ago
If HeAtid closed to appease teachers, that is not a good sign...they certainly did not have parents in mind when they chose to close this week.
As far as public school, there are many kids already there, but I think the message only rings for the rabbis in this "psak by the pulse of the people" mentality of a community when the numbers are more staggering...there are already dozens at all levels of the TPS....but i think in a community this size, rabbis simply write that off, and just let the masses file bankruptcy, not save for retirement or their future.
The system as it exists today must be revamped.
Yeshiva_Dad 69p · 651 weeks ago
I don't think this is true. At least not from Orthodox schools.
Yeshiva_Dad 69p · 651 weeks ago
Thank you for the kind words. I'm glad you find the blog useful.
As a matter of fact my school was open on chol hamoed. So were a lot of other schools. Maybe it was different in different neighborhoods or maybe we are different ages but our school was definitely open. We had a succah at the school and we went on some class trips. There's no good reason why school needs to be closed putting an additional burden on parents. Whether or not we were aware of it when we registered our kids is irrelevant. We should change the bad practices even if we were always aware of them.
As far as sending them to public school, if I had to I would. But I would much prefer to send them to Jewish Day Schools because I think that would be the best assurance that they stay frum and do not succumb to peer pressures to assimilate. It is asking a lot of a child to expect them to not go out to eat with their friends and to keep shabbat and Yom Tov when all of their friends are doing other things. If a parent choses the public school route I wish them the best of luck & certainly understand why they are doing it. But if we can work towards keeping tuition affordable and making it easier for parents to work to pay it why shouldn't we.
Fortunately some changes are being made and Jewish Day Schools are finally responding to our demands, for example, the opening of He'atid, the lowering of pre-school tuitions, the freezing of tuition for older grades, the increase in days of the school year, etc. We need to keep the pressure on so we don't go back to where things were with huge tuition increases every year. I think we were coming close to the tipping point where parents starting seeing public school as their only option.
Regarding your comment that tuition cost more in Manhattan, that is definitely true. People also may much more for rent or to buy apartments then they would in Teaneck. SAR Academy in Riverdale is also much more. People also pay much less in Monsey, Elizabeth, Staten Island, etc. People in all neighborhoods have a legitimate gripe but this blog is about Bergen County.
tesyaa · 651 weeks ago
guest · 651 weeks ago
guest · 651 weeks ago
guest · 651 weeks ago